Mark Webber v Red Bull

[Mothers Worry]

He is incredibly mature.

He's a spoiled child; you can see that from the way he acts both in and out of the car.

No maturity at all.

[Jiji_the_cat]

good to see flav promoting his boy, oops, man. Webber had answered all his critics this year (myself included). i really really really want him to take out the title, for a number of reasons.
I honestly think the biggest threat is going to be fatty not vettel.

[f1engineer]

vare ist de goot Doctor ven sebastian is, how du u say, shizar !!!!!
C'mon Dr Marko, where are you now? Is this one Buttons' fault?
  + =

[vicfrog]

vare ist de goot Doctor ven sebastian is, how du u say, shizar !!!!!
C'mon Dr Marko, where are you now? Is this one Buttons' fault?
  + =

:rofl:very nice f1

[kevrulezz]

I think this thread is more appropriate for this then the Webber vs Vettel thread

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/164445/1/horner_admits_were_building_rbr_around_vettel.html

Horner admits: We're building RBR around Vettel

Red Bull Racing team principal Christian Horner has conceded that the energy drinks-backed outfit is being built specifically around Sebastian Vettel, clearly seeing the 23-year-old as the squad's future whilst reflecting that Mark Webber is conversely now 'in the autumn of his career'.

There have been constant paddock murmurings this year that whilst Red Bull is eager to see one of its two drivers crowned F1 2010 World Champion come season's end, they would be considerably happier were that driver to be Vettel rather than Webber.

The contentious coming-together in Istanbul – when the German was defended and the Australian publicly blamed by team management for a costly collision that the vast majority of observers held to be the former's fault – and the now infamous front wing episode at Silverstone have only served to add fuel to the fire.

What's more, Horner's insistence that neither of the pair will be favoured over the final three races of the campaign has been perceived as an implicit admission that the team really wants Vettel to lift the laurels – given that Webber is currently 14 points ahead in the title standings, and would be the hot favourite to triumph if only he had the support of his team-mate as does the chasing Fernando Alonso at Ferrari.

Having previously quipped that he wanted to sign his young protégé up until '2028'; Horner's latest pronouncement appears to all-but confirm that 2010 represents Webber's only realistic chance of claiming world championship glory for himself – given that henceforth, he will likely be a mere postscript to Vettel's burning ambition and aspirations.

“I repeat, we are building the team around Sebastian,” the 36-year-old Englishman told German publication Auto Bild. “Sebastian has a long career ahead of him, and hopefully he will spend it with us. Mark is in the autumn of his career. He wants to retire while he's at the top, not when he's past his peak like some other drivers.”

my bold

That ladies and gentlemen is Christian Horner confirming the worst kept secret F1 has ever had in the modern era, if not of all time and is only a small stone's throw away from confirming RBR's obvious favouritism of Vettel.

If Vettel wins the title this year from Webber I will be buying grandstand tickets to the AGP next year on pit straight right across from Red Bull so I can hang a banner on the other side of the track for them to see all weekend, I will find a way to get on the Pitlane walk (you can buy them right?) and will spend my entire time standing outside the Red Bull garage with a custom made t-shirt (both with yet to be determined slogans/words).

I you not.

[Mothers Worry]

Yeah, it is the appropriate thread.

And, yes; we all knew that Christian I'm Horny for Vettel couldn't be trusted to tell the truth over the course of this season.

The worst kept secret is out.........

[damon074]

Can't see Mark honouring his contract for next season. Renault?

[Mothers Worry]

Can't see Mark honouring his contract for next season. Renault?

If he wins the WDC and has to buy himself out of his contract with RBR money should not be an obstacle.

[vicfrog]

If Vettel wins the title this year from Webber I will be buying grandstand tickets to the AGP next year on pit straight right across from Red Bull so I can hang a banner on the other side of the track for them to see all weekend, I will find a way to get on the Pitlane walk (you can buy them right?) and will spend my entire time standing outside the Red Bull garage with a custom made t-shirt (both with yet to be determined slogans/words).

I you not

spot on Kev ,
 if de seb does win it, start printing the tee shirts i'll buy ten.
and give you a hand to paint the banner

[Mothers Worry]

If Vettel wins the title this year from Webber I will be buying grandstand tickets to the AGP next year on pit straight right across from Red Bull so I can hang a banner on the other side of the track for them to see all weekend, I will find a way to get on the Pitlane walk (you can buy them right?) and will spend my entire time standing outside the Red Bull garage with a custom made t-shirt (both with yet to be determined slogans/words).

I you not

spot on Kev ,
 if de seb does win it, start printing the tee shirts i'll buy ten.
and give you a hand to paint the banner

There may be a queue of Aussies lining up to help you guys.

[blacknwhite]

Can't see Mark honouring his contract for next season. Renault?

If anywhere it will be Ferrari I reckon
Horner has to be the worst boss of a team out there!
Not only that he cannot hide his stiffy for ze germin he has to open his fly and wave it about as well!
Think no matter what the brave front Webber would be happier starting from 3rd than 2nd on this track
My Prediction......Alonso to jam it up the inside of Der Seb and it ends in tears ......and Webber with a slippery start and no traction avoids it all and walks it in

Or is it just wishful thinking!

[Jiji_the_cat]

Think no matter what the brave front Webber would be happier starting from 3rd than 2nd on this track
My Prediction......Alonso to jam it up the inside of Der Seb and it ends in tears ......and Webber with a slippery start and no traction avoids it all and walks it in

Or is it just wishful thinking!

i hope you have some kind of extra perception and your prediction comes true. Webber should go to Renault or Ferrari imo.

[blacknwhite]

From Autosport.com

Vettel will not be given support role   

By Simon Strang   Sunday, October 24th 2010, 11:09 GMT

Red Bull will not ask Sebastian Vettel to play a supporting role in Mark Webber's quest to win the Formula 1 World Championship title, despite the German's own chances slimming when he suffered an engine failure in the Korean Grand Prix.

Vettel was forced to retire from the lead of the race, and whereas victory would have given him the world championship lead, he is now fourth in the standings, 25 points behind Fernando Alonso and 14 behind team-mate Webber.

But Red Bull team principal Christian Horner said it was too early for Vettel to give up on his own challenge, and that things could turn around quickly just as they had in Yeongam - where Webber began the race as the points leader before crashing out.

"As we saw in this race, at different points during the race, different drivers were leading this championship," Horner told the BBC. "We gave a big gift to Fernando today and as a team we need to look at that, but we've seen how quickly this can change.

"In last year's scoring there is only 10 points between Sebastian and Fernando and obviously Mark is even closer than that so our strategy will be to push both drivers.

"It would be wrong [to ask Vettel to do that]. Nobody has a crystal ball and if anybody could have predicted today's race I'm sure they would have done very, very well. This championship is not over until the last lap in Abu Dhabi and we will be pushing flat out until that point in time."

Red Bull started the inaugural Korean F1 race with both its cars on the front row, and Horner admitted that it was a bitter experience to come away from the event with zero points.

"Sometimes motor racing can be cruel and for Red Bull it was one of those days," he said. "Sebastian and the team had done everything right, read the strategy and the conditions.

"He got himself in to a commanding position, almost in sight of the end of the race and then a catastrophic engine failure unfortunately denied us a certain race victory.

"Mark hasn't made many errors this year, but unfortunately made one today that cost him dearly. Mark is obviously bitterly upset with what happened today, but he will bounce back. After Valencia, which was the last time he had a DNF - he came back and won the next race. He'll bounce back at Brazil, it's a track he enjoys.

"Sebastian has been remarkably philosophical. He's dealt with that issue. It's cruel for him because it is not the first time and to lose a guaranteed victory right now is tough."

They really do not want to win it do they!!!!!!
In the end Horner will do whatever the big bosses want regardless of costing the team the championship, and then who will get the arse because of it.....Horner!
At least there is one positive outcome out of this incompetence!

[Mothers Worry]

They really do not want to win it do they!!!!!!
In the end Horner will do whatever the big bosses want regardless of costing the team the championship, and then who will get the arse because of it.....Horner!
At least there is one positive outcome out of this incompetence!

Yes; it certainly appears that way.

I am really disappointed that the Webmaster resigned with RBR and its treacherous team principal Horner for another year.

As an aside: Mentioning Christin Horny, the spoiled German brat and arse in the same comment is possibly not a good idea.....    

[Jiji_the_cat]

RBR are their own worst enemy. 

[kevrulezz]

They really do not want to win it do they!!!!!!

That's incorrect! They do want to win....



only they want to win with Vettel, not Webber

[Mothers Worry]

I really hope RBR don't win the constructors' championship.

[damon074]

From Autosport.com

Vettel will not be given support role   

By Simon Strang   Sunday, October 24th 2010, 11:09 GMT

Red Bull will not ask Sebastian Vettel to play a supporting role in Mark Webber's quest to win the Formula 1 World Championship title, despite the German's own chances slimming when he suffered an engine failure in the Korean Grand Prix.

Vettel was forced to retire from the lead of the race, and whereas victory would have given him the world championship lead, he is now fourth in the standings, 25 points behind Fernando Alonso and 14 behind team-mate Webber.

But Red Bull team principal Christian Horner said it was too early for Vettel to give up on his own challenge, and that things could turn around quickly just as they had in Yeongam - where Webber began the race as the points leader before crashing out.

"As we saw in this race, at different points during the race, different drivers were leading this championship," Horner told the BBC. "We gave a big gift to Fernando today and as a team we need to look at that, but we've seen how quickly this can change.

"In last year's scoring there is only 10 points between Sebastian and Fernando and obviously Mark is even closer than that so our strategy will be to push both drivers.

"It would be wrong [to ask Vettel to do that]. Nobody has a crystal ball and if anybody could have predicted today's race I'm sure they would have done very, very well. This championship is not over until the last lap in Abu Dhabi and we will be pushing flat out until that point in time."

Red Bull started the inaugural Korean F1 race with both its cars on the front row, and Horner admitted that it was a bitter experience to come away from the event with zero points.

"Sometimes motor racing can be cruel and for Red Bull it was one of those days," he said. "Sebastian and the team had done everything right, read the strategy and the conditions.

"He got himself in to a commanding position, almost in sight of the end of the race and then a catastrophic engine failure unfortunately denied us a certain race victory.

"Mark hasn't made many errors this year, but unfortunately made one today that cost him dearly. Mark is obviously bitterly upset with what happened today, but he will bounce back. After Valencia, which was the last time he had a DNF - he came back and won the next race. He'll bounce back at Brazil, it's a track he enjoys.

"Sebastian has been remarkably philosophical. He's dealt with that issue. It's cruel for him because it is not the first time and to lose a guaranteed victory right now is tough."

They really do not want to win it do they!!!!!!
In the end Horner will do whatever the big bosses want regardless of costing the team the championship, and then who will get the arse because of it.....Horner!
At least there is one positive outcome out of this incompetence!

I can't believe they won't back Webber. Vettel has next to no chance now. RBR are a real chance of going 1-2 in the next 2 races and if Seb just played rear gunner both championships are theres. Too many things have to go Sebs way for the WDC and if they let them race i reckon both championships are gone.

[blacknwhite]

All we can hope for is that they will now look at the points and decide the pragmatic view that if either RBR driver is to win it it will be Webber, and all this is publicity speak to save the crap that was directed at Ferrari. (Red Bull should also take note that since they started backing Alonso this "amazingly" coincides with the resurgence of Ferrari as a real contender...just a thought)
You can bet your life on this realization being recognised down at Mclaren and no matter what is uttered from Button ,Hamilton or Whitmarsh Button will be the tailgunner for Hamilton
I know the German's are a stubborn lot (my wife is one ,even she hates das wunderkind!) but they normally are realists as well, they must decide privately even if they do not publicly state it that they want the Red Bulls to win both the drivers and manufacturers championship or they want Vettel to finish runner up

[Mothers Worry]

Webber might get team edge for Brazil

From AAP via Yahoo!7 Sport:

Webber might get team edge for Brazil

October 26, 2010

Red Bull says the Formula One championship fight could go down to the last lap of the last race - but have not ruled out finally giving Mark Webber their full backing.

Even though both Webber and Red Bull teammate Sebastian Vettel trudged away from last Sunday's Korean GP without any points, the Australian has ended up retaining the stronger position.

While Webber crashed out due to an unforced error and Vettel's Renault engine blew up while he was leading, Ferrari's Fernando Alonso was handed the win and along with it the title lead.

With two races remaining, Brazil on Nov 7 and Abu Dhabi on November 14, the championship will be a shootout between Alonso (231 points), Webber (220), Lewis Hamilton (210) and Vettel (206).

Now, with Webber still the team's best hope of seizing the crown, Red Bull are considering their tactics ahead of the Brazilian round.

There is pressure to back Webber ahead of Vettel but team boss Christian Horner is cautious about the outfit's tactical approach.

But he admits that any intra-team squabble between the pair could play into Ferrari's hands.

Red Bull have clearly been the quickest cars this season but if Webber and Vettel were to work together to try to ensure Webber wins the last two races and they keep Alonso no higher than third, the Australian could take the title.

Webber would then have 270 points, whereas two wins to Vettel would put him on 256. Two third places to Alonso would give him 261 points.

If Alonso wins in Brazil and Webber can manage no more than 35 points from the final two races the Ferrari driver would win the title.

Horner has yet to make up his mind about how Red Bull will approach Brazil.

"I haven't had time to look at all the mathematics and scenarios, but it is something that we will look at pretty closely between now and Brazil," Horner told autosport.com.

"Obviously the objective for both of them is to be ahead of Fernando and Lewis, as we achieved in qualifying in Korea."

But he is still resisting any push to make Webber a clear favourite.

"As you saw in (the Korean) grand prix, the championship leader changed between three different drivers at three different points of the race, and we gifted Fernando Alonso 25 points, which is obviously frustrating.

"This championship will go to the last lap in Abu Dhabi I believe.

"Mark retains P2 in the championship and Sebastian has now dropped to fourth, but there is still only a race win between Sebastian in fourth and Alonso in the lead.

"And how many times have we seen this year the championship to and fro? So it is impossible to predict what will happen in Brazil and Abu Dhabi."

Either Horner is a complete idiot or he has such little personal power as a team leader that he is a total puppet of his bosses. Anyone can see that RBR should be backing their only hope for the WDC, which is Webber, and backing him 110%.


Here are a few comments from the general public that accompanied this news story:

We as Australians should back mark webber for the F1 title the first one in 30years, go on give the man the the backing and make all Australians proud.

Red Bull should back Webber, because even Vettel wins both races and Alonso finishes third on one, he only needs 5th place on the last one to be World Champion. If Webber wins Brazil, Alonso third, Webber is only one point behind Alonso and any position ahead of Alonso gives him the win... Red Bull have to play smart, otherwise, they will lose it....and Dieter (the boss) will not be really happy at all....

Should have backed Webber many races ago so he would be in a better position now. Go Webber!

realise that Red Bull is Austrian, same language as German= Vettel Casrs are IT in Germany, market is huge, it is very hard to back a man who is a foreigner understand this I like Mark, the complete racer, a very mature man, even tempered man, as opposed to this petulant(when losing) brat Vettel ,

red bull should back mark all the way he has been the best driver all year. give us aussie fans what we have been waiting a long time for.

No matter what is gonna happen we all back webber... if webber doesn't win this year there is still another year I my self prefer alonso instead of vettel because obviously the team is prefer vettel rather than webber this is unfair ...go webber